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DinoRider

"moped" Crime in London

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Apparently "moped" crime is on a sharp rise in london. There were just over 1,000 incidents in 2014.

 

In 2016 that number had risen to about 7,500 and the BBC reported 

"The Met said the rise, which was mainly due to teenagers stealing mopeds and using them to commit crimes, was a "huge concern".

It has, however, denied the problem is "out of control". In this article:

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/video_and_audio/headlines/38309113/huge-concern-as-teen-moped-crime-in-london-rises

 

Now we're in 2018 and, depending on the article you come across, there has been 22,000 to 24,000 moped crimes in London in the past 12 months.  Seems like this problem could have been nipped in the bud before it got out of control, or maybe it's still not at "out of control" levels yet.

Here's an article from the BBC from May this year.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-44045128

 

It even has a tool so you can see how badly your neighborhood is affected!

 

I'm just at a loss as to how something like this can spiral out of control the way it has, idk.

 

I've read articles that say police are afraid to pursue, because if the perp gets injured the policeman/woman can be charged with a crime.

 

I'm left scratchin my head on this one.

 

 

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This explodes the same way our homeless problem explodes - liberals in control.

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6 hours ago, Barneyboy said:

This explodes the same way our homeless problem explodes - liberals in control.

Um, isn't the PM a conservative? Wasn't the previous PM also a conservative? Isn't the conservative party in control? Actually if we want to be pedantic, I don't think the "Liberal Democratic" party even makes up 1% of their parliament. 

 

B-Boy, we talked about this! C'mon, man! 

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4 hours ago, Moso said:

Um, isn't the PM a conservative? Wasn't the previous PM also a conservative? Isn't the conservative party in control? Actually if we want to be pedantic, I don't think the "Liberal Democratic" party even makes up 1% of their parliament. 

 

B-Boy, we talked about this! C'mon, man! 

Well, if you read the posting you would have noticed that the problem was taking place in London. I thought the mayor of London was, no,  is a leftist. Yes, this is the same London that has an explosion in stabbing deaths.  I read somewhere that the mayor has also banned certain length knives.  It must be scary living in London.

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16 hours ago, Barneyboy said:

This explodes the same way our homeless problem explodes - liberals in control.

If you can in any way, logically connect the homeless problem in CA (for example) to any kind of moped usage, legal or not, in the UK, I will bow to you as supreme leader and vote for you in the next pres election/ I respect your right to be as hardcore conservative as you like, but your post literally added nothing to the conversation. What do you think has led to the dramatic increase?  Apparently cops can be charged with crimes (such as reckless driving) If they pursue, what you say 'bout that?

 

It does appear that most of the perps are believed to be teenagers, WTF is wrong with kids these days! (at least I'm not referencing their music with that statement :P )

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8 minutes ago, DinoRider said:

It does appear that most of the perps are believed to be teenagers, WTF is wrong with kids these days! (at least I'm not referencing their music with that statement :P )

I can't speak much for London, but I would be interested to compare it to other major developed cities around the world. If it's anything like the US, and some of the UK is reminiscent of the US, we can go into the argument of misplace values and corroding culture. We could blame capitalism, for example. There are decent arguments there even if we extend them into non-capitalistic countries. We could blame human nature. Or maybe it's just white culture, haha. England is historically noted as being pretty darn violent, for example. Might even be "nicer" now, considering what we compare it with. 

All I can really comment on is that while I don't know any absolutely safe place -- indeed it surely doesn't exist -- the nicest/safest places I've encountered have been simple, with little desire for power over fellow-persons; they've been places that didn't flaunt wealth, not having an obvious "bourgeoisie" with distinct poor-rich divide we could say (there were certainly wealthy people, but it wasn't so flaunted); and they've been places where most were from a young age taught to be nice to each other. They were raised with good role models, be them local or national. I would like to add education, but that hasn't been a common factor. 

I don't know if any of this really helps, but I think of it time to time. People raised to be kind to each other, respect the world around them, and help each other. Raised to do well, sure, but not be concerned with ambition to dominate their fellow men and women. Not so much unhealthy competition. Not so much concern with lavish money. But.... well, yeah, anyway.

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52 minutes ago, DinoRider said:

If you can in any way, logically connect the homeless problem in CA (for example) to any kind of moped usage, legal or not, in the UK, I will bow to you as supreme leader and vote for you in the next pres election/ I respect your right to be as hardcore conservative as you like, but your post literally added nothing to the conversation. What do you think has led to the dramatic increase?  Apparently cops can be charged with crimes (such as reckless driving) If they pursue, what you say 'bout that?

 

It does appear that most of the perps are believed to be teenagers, WTF is wrong with kids these days! (at least I'm not referencing their music with that statement :P )

You asked how a problem like this can spiral out of control. I simply provided a comparison of what can happen when liberals are in control of their cities.  We have an explosive homeless problem in LA, San Francisco, Santa Ana and elsewhere in California.  All these cities have one common denominator - they are all run by democrats. These libs roll out the welcome carpet to the homeless population instead of enforcing laws to prevent them from setting up camps everywhere.  We recently had to clean up a homeless encampment in the Santa Ana reservoir. The clean up crew had to don haz mat outfits to clean up the area.  Over 10,000 needles and tons of human waste had to be dumped. Let me give you another example. Detroit, St. Louis, Baltimore, Oakland and Stockton.  These are the most dangerous cities to live in.  What do they all have in common?  They are all run by democrat mayors.  Do you see a pattern developing?  You were wondering how this has grown so out of control well my answer is that the problem will only continue to increase because those in charge of their cities allow it to happen. Please understand, the cops are acting under the orders of the mayor's office. 

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Arent almost all large cities run by Democrat mayors? 

 

https://ballotpedia.org/List_of_current_mayors_of_the_top_100_cities_in_the_United_States

 

If there was a validity to your argument, you would be able to correlate crime vs. this list - Please share your analysis!

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11 minutes ago, fabkebab said:

Arent almost all large cities run by Democrat mayors? 

 

https://ballotpedia.org/List_of_current_mayors_of_the_top_100_cities_in_the_United_States

 

If there was a validity to your argument, you would be able to correlate crime vs. this list - Please share your analysis!

https://www.forbes.com/pictures/mlj45jggj/1-detroit/ 

Top 10 most dangerous and crime infested cities in the US.   All of them run by democrat mayors. Yes, the problem is that most large cities are run by democrats. My analysis speaks for itself. 

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       I can agree with you @Barneyboy that poor policy making can lead to problems down the road. If London has 'rules of engagement' for police, or restrictions on their persuit of criminals that are intended on protecting the public the end result could be criminals know the ins and outs of these restrictions and how to use them to their advantage. And the public feels less protected by policies intended to protect them. 

        In California you see first hand, as a resident there, the consequences of poor policy making. I saw it in New York. 

        I think blaming this on capitalism and white culture are quite a stretch, @Moso as it's presumptuous to assume the ethnic breakdowns of criminals based on no information whatsoever in the two articles provided by @DinoRider. Maybe you've researched it further and have information the rest of us don't.

        The comparison between capitalist and non- capitalist societies is of limited value because it's not the economic market system in place that is determinitive. It's the style of governing. People who can be executed on the spot for offences in a dictatorship might be more cautious to commit unsanctioned crimes than people in societies where police and courts have to use restraints. 

          Where I live now there is a phenomena  known as riding in tandem that has some paralells to the London situation. It may be a precurser to London's future. Two guys riding a motorcycle, wearing full face helmets to conceal their identities, ride up to someone, usually a politician, and execute them before riding away. 

          Sometimes the victim is in a car stuck in traffic and sometimes the victim has just stepped out their front door. But these contract killers use the maneuverability of the motorcycles to evade capture. Very very few have ever been caught. 

          Usually it's political in nature. Politicians. Opposition candidates. Community organizers protesting disenfranchisement of the poor, journalists, and lately, priests. People who threaten the status quo. Most people here would say the situation is completely out of hand and getting worse.  

            Motorcycle snatch and grab thefts here (cellphones jewelry handbags, etc.) has long been an issue because motorcycles are so common. If someone ever gets arrested for anything here the average wait time for trials can be many years. By that time witnesses die or wander away. 

           

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41 minutes ago, Barneyboy said:

https://www.forbes.com/pictures/mlj45jggj/1-detroit/ 

Top 10 most dangerous and crime infested cities in the US.   All of them run by democrat mayors. Yes, the problem is that most large cities are run by democrats. My analysis speaks for itself. 

not good enough - but I am not going to take any more time - I come for the music, and foolishly have been lured into a kind of facebook conversation

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2 hours ago, kuya said:

I think blaming this on capitalism and white culture are quite a stretch, @Moso 

Sorry, I was just trying to bring up classic arguments, not taking a side with any - quite the opposite, trying to clean the mill of the common, saying popular excuses. No real intent to blame anything on capitalism or white culture but instead cast them as examples of known arguments. My post wasn't very solid, I know. 

Though, well, heck... these could be interesting to explore further... capitalism, laissez-faire, is a fuckstick. It has its pros, for sure, but unbridled it's like social Darwinism reborn. EDIT: Meaning to say, I think capitalism has proper useful strengths, but in an unbridled "Mongo like candy" form, is extremely destructive. It seems to operate best in a more balanced degree of the spectrum, as opposed to a no-rules gunfighter town. (Man, I really wanted to specify a historical town here but my brain broke. Any reminders?) 

 

2 hours ago, kuya said:

The comparison between capitalist and non- capitalist societies is of limited value because it's not the economic market system in place that is determinitive. It's the style of governing. People who can be executed on the spot for offences in a dictatorship might be more cautious to commit unsanctioned crimes than people in societies where police and courts have to use restraints.

For what it's worth, capitalism has been a decisively strong factor in sociopolitical environments touted as non-capitalistic.

 

And man, it sounds like you're living in a pretty nasty place! You frequently talk about how bad it is over there, and I can't help but think, yeah, that's really bad! 

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Yes, it looks as if there is a problem with this. It's mainly in a smallish area of NW London but it is a problem. Let's hope they can sort it out.

 

The police do give chase, by the way. I understand they have even sourced special bikes to do so (their large motorcycles weren't suited for racing down alleyways).

 

As far as the mayor is concerned, things don't work quite the same over here. The majority of police funding is from central government and there have been massive cuts in police budgets. The city does also contribute to policing budgets but is not the main player (and the police do not report to the mayor - though they do work together on local priorities). https://www.london.gov.uk/press-releases/mayoral/budget-confirms-110m-for-met-police

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So this is a crime spike as opposed to just another way of doing crimes, right? I've heard of this sort of thing before, as has kuya, though I think his experiences are extreme. Fwiw, stealing bikes and using them for petty theft totally sounds like a kid thing to do. The younger, naïve, rebellious, bored types. 

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10 hours ago, Alistair S said:

Yes, it looks as if there is a problem with this. It's mainly in a smallish area of NW London but it is a problem. Let's hope they can sort it out.

 

The police do give chase, by the way. I understand they have even sourced special bikes to do so (their large motorcycles weren't suited for racing down alleyways).

 

As far as the mayor is concerned, things don't work quite the same over here. The majority of police funding is from central government and there have been massive cuts in police budgets. The city does also contribute to policing budgets but is not the main player (and the police do not report to the mayor - though they do work together on local priorities). https://www.london.gov.uk/press-releases/mayoral/budget-confirms-110m-for-met-police

From 1000 in 2014 to 22,000 currently is quite an impressive increase.  Surely, there must be some speculation as to why and who are causing this crime wave.  I have my suspicions about the who but will keep that to myself for fear of getting TR'ed. The article is not specific as to the mayor/police relationship other than the mayor being responsible for the police budget.  What department oversees the police if not the mayor?  It looks like the mayor reduced police personnel from 14,000 to just under 10,000 so your comment about the police not reporting to the mayor is confusing. It looks like the businesses are going to bear the costs for additional police along with a council tax, whatever that means.  Is it time for Londoners to panic?  Is it time to arm Londoners?  I hope it does not get to the point where criminals will run this once great city. 

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The police are funded by the Home Office - a government department. It is the conservative government who have cut budgets. The city is providing additional funds to make up the difference (and may have to increase Council Tax - which is like city taxes - to do so).

 

Who is doing it? Youth gangs in a few areas. It's an easy crime to get away with (steal a motorcycle, wear a helmet and steal a purse). They will be stopped, but it won't be easy (it's hard to identify someone in a motorcycle helmet!).

 

Panic? That's ridiculous. First, it isn't even on most people's radar and second, you don't know Londoners if you even think that. Arm Londoners? Don't make me laugh. Nobody is even scared.

 

Really, you need to stop reading whatever websites are feeding you this stuff (or radio shows, or whatever). 

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23 hours ago, Alistair S said:

The police are funded by the Home Office - a government department. It is the conservative government who have cut budgets. The city is providing additional funds to make up the difference (and may have to increase Council Tax - which is like city taxes - to do so).

 

Who is doing it? Youth gangs in a few areas. It's an easy crime to get away with (steal a motorcycle, wear a helmet and steal a purse). They will be stopped, but it won't be easy (it's hard to identify someone in a motorcycle helmet!).

 

Panic? That's ridiculous. First, it isn't even on most people's radar and second, you don't know Londoners if you even think that. Arm Londoners? Don't make me laugh. Nobody is even scared.

 

Really, you need to stop reading whatever websites are feeding you this stuff (or radio shows, or whatever). 

Well, it was on dino's radar cause he posted his concerns.  I'm just reading from postings posted by a muser who might have a different perspective than yourself. Well, among this rapidly accelerating moped crime rate, record stabbing murders and domestic terrorism (vans mowing down people) I'm just wondering what it will take before Londoners start turning on their radars.

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OK. Fair enough. I'm lying. London is horribly - and I mean really horribly - dangerous. It's like a war zone. Take my advice - don't come here! You'd be lucky to survive!

 

Spoiler: It's the 7th safest city in the World - https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articles/931694/safest-cities-in-the-world-2018-singapore

 

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16 minutes ago, Alistair S said:

OK. Fair enough. I'm lying. London is horribly - and I mean really horribly - dangerous. It's like a war zone. Take my advice - don't come here! You'd be lucky to survive!

 

Spoiler: It's the 7th safest city in the World - https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articles/931694/safest-cities-in-the-world-2018-singapore

 

Nay, not much of a traveler. I like to stay local.  Besides, I enjoy the company of my dogs over visiting foreign countries.  

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Zombie knife terror in London

Is the latest headline I've come across in my trip down the rabbit hole.

 

excerpts from article that can be found here

 

https://www.qt.com.au/news/welcome-to-lawless-london-home-of-zombie-knives-mo/3443310/

 

Many blame the attacks on years of austerity that has seen police numbers reduced and welfare budgets cut. London Mayor Sadiq Khan this week met with Home Secretary Sajid Javid to discuss the crisis as public concern grows.

"It's not rocket science. You can't cut thousands of police officers and close services without it having an impact on crime … this is now a national emergency," Mr Khan said.

 

The fear of being stabbed is fuelling paranoia in some British youth, particularly London males. Some are now wearing stab proof vests on the streets to protect themselves from the violence.

 

Is the Queensland Times a credible source? Idk, but looks legit.

 

I still can't make much sense of it, maybe I never will. It's been blamed on everything from crack cocaine to "drill" music (Chicago style gangsta rap from what I gather).  There were too many distractions for me to stay focused on just one thing.

 

YouTube, Urged By Scotland Yard, Removes Rap Videos Blamed For Violence

https://www.npr.org/sections/therecord/2018/05/30/615291320/youtube-urged-by-scotland-yard-removes-rap-videos-blamed-for-violence

Is one such headline related to "drill" music.

 

Here i was thinking it was gonna be a simple explanation like "meh, it's a seasonal thing" or "just kids being kids" Looks like I'll just wait for the book someone is bound to write after all the dust settles. 

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8 hours ago, Alistair S said:

It's the 7th safest city in the World

Chicago is 3rd! London seems to be in good company :P

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7 hours ago, DinoRider said:

Zombie knife terror in London

Is the latest headline I've come across in my trip down the rabbit hole.

 

excerpts from article that can be found here

 

https://www.qt.com.au/news/welcome-to-lawless-london-home-of-zombie-knives-mo/3443310/

 

Many blame the attacks on years of austerity that has seen police numbers reduced and welfare budgets cut. London Mayor Sadiq Khan this week met with Home Secretary Sajid Javid to discuss the crisis as public concern grows.

"It's not rocket science. You can't cut thousands of police officers and close services without it having an impact on crime … this is now a national emergency," Mr Khan said.

 

The fear of being stabbed is fuelling paranoia in some British youth, particularly London males. Some are now wearing stab proof vests on the streets to protect themselves from the violence.

 

Is the Queensland Times a credible source? Idk, but looks legit.

 

I still can't make much sense of it, maybe I never will. It's been blamed on everything from crack cocaine to "drill" music (Chicago style gangsta rap from what I gather).  There were too many distractions for me to stay focused on just one thing.

 

YouTube, Urged By Scotland Yard, Removes Rap Videos Blamed For Violence

https://www.npr.org/sections/therecord/2018/05/30/615291320/youtube-urged-by-scotland-yard-removes-rap-videos-blamed-for-violence

Is one such headline related to "drill" music.

 

Here i was thinking it was gonna be a simple explanation like "meh, it's a seasonal thing" or "just kids being kids" Looks like I'll just wait for the book someone is bound to write after all the dust settles. 

Now, this is a different thing altogether,and it's troubling. There HAS been a significant increase in violent crime over the last year.

 

I'd like to say that it's all drug gang related, but it's not (some is, but it's more widespread than that). I don't think we can seriously blame a few rap videos!! We do know that there has been a glut of cocaine available, and that may well have something to do with it (so maybe there is a drugs link even if it's not just gang-members doing it). 

 

Apparently, the Met has set up a task force to deal with the problem as part pf a broader strategy and, while early days, it does seem to be having some success (knife crime has at least stopped increasing and homicides are considerably down since Feb and March). Operation Sceptre

 

 

Let's hope they are successful. London is still a safe city but has become less so for younger men in poorer areas and that kind of thing can escalate very easily (people who feel under threat start to respond - possibly by carrying weapons themselves - and add to the problem).

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