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Quintin penola

Key Analysis

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Hello all, I have a Song that seems to not have a key. In the Key of Ethier G major or Bb major, but has a minor tonality. The chords are  Gmajor, Amajor, Fmajor, Bbmajor,Dmajor and Ebmajor. Can anyone teall me the key?

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It starts in G major, and then the cadence is D major to Eb major? Or are you just writing out all the chords in the song?

Can you chart it out? 

 

One approach you can take is that it modulates. Another approach is to forget the "majors", and consider the root of each chord, as if you were doing lots of substitution, or riding major chords like some music does with dominant. (This would make Bb major and G minor suspect.) Just options. But it would be more useful if you charted the song for us. Direction -- where the chords are going and when -- is very important for this kind of thing. 

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58 minutes ago, Moso said:

It starts in G major, and then the cadence is D major to Eb major? Or are you just writing out all the chords in the song?

Can you chart it out? 

 

One approach you can take is that it modulates. Another approach is to forget the "majors", and consider the root of each chord, as if you were doing lots of substitution, or riding major chords like some music does with dominant. (This would make Bb major and G minor suspect.) Just options. But it would be more useful if you charted the song for us. Direction -- where the chords are going and when -- is very important for this kind of thing. 

Ok The Chords Are Gmajor, Amajor Fmajor, Bb major, Cmajor, Dmajor, and Ebmajor. In the Key of G major the Bb, Eb and the F would need explanation In Bb Major I have the G as a V/ii, A V/iii, F V, Bb I, C V/V, and the Eb as a IV chords. This would be strange because the tonal center would be V/ii???? I suck at theory mabey you can give another analysis.

 

Infatuated    91bpm 4/4    Rock/punk/blues  Key?????? Gmajor or Bbmajor. mabey modal 

Verse 

Can't get you outta my head

G                                    A

I shoud'nt be thinkin about you

                                      F    

but I'm in love my heart surrendered

               Bb                    G           F     

 

Verse 2

You never really meant no harm

G                                            A

it seems I just cant move on

                                     F

I cant get it righttttt...

   F             G

 

Pre chorus/bridge

Im infacuated girl and

C                              C

I adore you,....

                     Bb

but it seems impossible to

C                                    C

 

make you mine.....

                          Bb

and it seems un-factual you'd

C                                         C

come this way...

        Bb

I need you next to me

C

I really really wanna rock your world  oh oh ohuuohhohh

  D                          D

 

 Chorus

  Baby girl,

G        D

 

I don't wanna close my eyes

                     F           C

I don't wanna say goodbye

                    Eb          Bb

I really miss you girls

     F

 

  Baby girl,

G        D

Every single day go bye

                  F         C

wishin you was by my side

                      Eb       Bb

I really miss you girl

       F

 

Verse 

You never really gave a shit

G                                      A

You know I woudnt call you bitch......bitch

                                                 F    

but your tourturing my mind

             Bb                 G           F     

 

Verse 2

Think about you night to dawn

G                                       A

it seems I just cant move on

                                     F

I cant get it righttttt...

   F             G

 

Pre chorus/bridge

Im infacuated girl and

C                              C

I adore you,....

                     Bb

but it seems impossible to

C                                    C

 

make you mine.....

                          Bb

and it seems un-factual you'd

C                                         C

come this way...

        Bb

I need you next to me

C

I really really wanna rock your world  oh oh ohuuohhohh

  D                          D

 

Chorus

  Baby girl,

G        D

 

I don't wanna close my eyes

                     F           C

I don't wanna say goodbye

                    Eb          Bb

I really miss you girls

    F

 

  Baby girl,

G        D

Theres will be a day I know

                       F       C

Overcome this crush I hold

                      Eb       Bb

I really miss you girl

    F

non-sense syllables  Ending

WhoaOOOoooo,  now,now nowww, My, my my  WhoaOoooo

G      D               F            C           Eb        Bb             G...............

 

 

Back to the beginning repeat ....

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Are you power chording through this? If that's the case, just consider the root of the chords. 

Are you actually barring major shapes throughout? If that's the case, I would still probably just consider the root of the chords. 

 

Are you trying to figure out the key for soloing? If so, try rolling with a pentatonic scale, see if that works. Otherwise, you can always just tool around, doing whatever you want, and see where it leads you. (Starting freestyle instead of thinking of scales specifically.) You could try a major-minor pentatonic, too, if you want, but that might give it too much of a blues/swing feel... depends... 

 

Anyway, you start on G and end on G. That's pretty telling. Your roots are in minor. G minor. 

Sounds like you're getting hung up on the idea that you're playing major chords throughout. (Though again I'm curious if you're power chording or actually playing full major chords throughout.) 

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Power chords tend to be 3 notes, but yes you can say im power chording. This song need electric guitar but i wrote it on a acoustic guitar. The first four notes chord will be an arpeggio G,D,G,B. Then Th A major open chrods.. the fisrt four notes. Same for the F major Chord,. The the Bbmajor will be strummed and the G Major wil be strummed. Repeate,. Then you can strum they next part Bbmajor to Cmajor  and the Dmajor full chords in any voicing, but started with the C marjor on the 3rd fret barred, then go up to the Bbmajor. The Dmajor is open D major chord. Then all the rest of the chords is played fully on the guitar, except for the  Gmajor(first four notes) and the Fmajor( 1st four). I plat the Eb as a D major shape on the 3rd fret. Hope that helps. The notes for the lyrics, I'm singing Gminor pentatonic/ with a bit of G major. F minor is in the and im sure mores. But what I want is a roman numeral analysis lol.

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Power chords are first and fifth. 

 

It really sounds like you're overcomplicating this. If you're actually playing major chords all throughout, then your roman numeral analysis would contain all majors. If that doesn't make sense, then consider that you're either substituting chords, or modulating, or both. Not sure if you're really modulating, although you could for example just say your prechorus is in C. What type of C is pretty open. Maybe mixolydian. 

 

Anyway, you could totally have: I II bIII IV V bVI bVII, tonic center G, solos in G minor. It wouldn't be crazy. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Moso said:

Power chords are first and fifth. 

 

It really sounds like you're overcomplicating this. If you're actually playing major chords all throughout, then your roman numeral analysis would contain all majors. If that doesn't make sense, then consider that you're either substituting chords, or modulating, or both. Not sure if you're really modulating, although you could for example just say your prechorus is in C. What type of C is pretty open. Maybe mixolydian. 

 

Anyway, you could totally have: I II bIII IV V bVI bVII, tonic center G, solos in G minor. It wouldn't be crazy. 

 

 

Intresting. I'd just say its in G. started recording seems to work out, I just need electric guitars beacuse it needs those power chords. So im structuring the song with the Acoustic guitar in order for some one to add to rock power to it. I wants 2 electric guitars double takes panned left and right, and bass guitar ofcorse

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Based on what I "see" This ends up being somewhat modal with a lot of "keys of the moment." For instance, the pre-chorus appears to be in C. Traditional analysis isn't worth a lot here because there's little in the way of traditional dominant motion, and when there is "traditional" motion, like these subdominant (plagal) cadences.. G-D F-C Eb-Bb, they are one-timers. Suffice it to say, I agree with most people above. Tonal Center G, and if I was scoring it, I'd probable have it in one sharp the whole way through, and deal with the accidentals as they pop up.

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Blues and neo-swing are often like this, but instead of being all major chords, they're all dominant chords throughout: 1 3 5 b7. The keys in these cases frequently go by the root of the chords (though soloists sometimes treat them as changing keys constantly -- depending on how the song is structured). And once you bring in the electric guitars and start slamming those power chords, the song even more sounds like minor. I think also Jack White plays like you are on the acoustic -- a bunch of major chords in minor keys. 

 

For scales, the songs can be considered major, minor, mixolydian... you can even mix minor and major for a "major-minor" scale. 

 

When "scoring" a song like this with guitar, the chords may be written above, not on the staff. If you do want to write the guitar notes on a staff, you can put that staff in a different key if you want, but either way you're going to be working with a lot of accidentals. The main staff however would contain the main melodies, which would be the vocals, and which you say you are singing mostly in minor. 

 

Bottom line -- what you're doing is not really all that strange. You seemed determined to call this G major, and that's fine, but you have said roots are in minor and your lead melody is in minor. Like M57 pointed out, you don't have a lot of traditional/classical cadences, just some basic sD-T movement here and there. This is fairly normal for popular music. 

 

Again, I think you're overcomplicating this. But if you want to, try looking at it a section at a time, and setting your keys that way. 

 

EDIT: If you're dead-set on finding out what this song is really doing, score just your lead melody and your bass notes and then analyze that. Everything after this is embellishment. 

 

EDIT: I'll say it again, "You could totally have: I II bIII IV V bVI bVII, tonic center G, solos in G minor. It wouldn't be crazy. "

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Btw, you say you've been recording? Let's hear it! 

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4 hours ago, Moso said:

Btw, you say you've been recording? Let's hear it! 

 

9 hours ago, M57 said:

Based on what I "see" This ends up being somewhat modal with a lot of "keys of the moment." For instance, the pre-chorus appears to be in C. Traditional analysis isn't worth a lot here because there's little in the way of traditional dominant motion, and when there is "traditional" motion, like these subdominant (plagal) cadences.. G-D F-C Eb-Bb, they are one-timers. Suffice it to say, I agree with most people above. Tonal Center G, and if I was scoring it, I'd probable have it in one sharp the whole way through, and deal with the accidentals as they pop up.

M57!! how you been! Thanks for the feedback. Its kinda of was a joke to put a roman numeral analysis on this song(kinda of i still like to see how folks would analyize something out of the norm).  I worked my way backwards so I started the progession I play in the Chorus in the Key of G ( no lyrics), Then came the verse using the Gmajor chord going to Amajor so on(lyrics). From there went to the prechorus(lyrics) thingy which lead lead the the Chorus (lyrics). Mabey this can bring further analysis. I have the frame work to add the electric guitars, Im going to put it on Ohm studio and see if anyone will put some electric guitar on it and bass, If not I'll try with the shitty elctric guitar I have and ampire. I just want to creates an enviroment in this track, so know the keys and how thing are working might help a little. The track will have two electric guitars and electric bass. I was also thing some live tomborine.  The first 8 bars (is the intro) is going to be and interlude with mabey a guitar solo and vocal imrprove, and i might stick that back in after the chorus for another solo.

 

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Ty vole, do us a favor and the next time you have a question like this, don't just give all the chords you're using in the song. <strike>It's meaningless.</strike> It doesn't really help us figure anything out. Give us either a real chord chart, or a combo of a text "chord chart" like here plus a recording of the song so we know the timing. Huge difference. Now we have a much better idea of what the relationships between the chords are.

 

You're playing around with more than one key here and doing a lot of substitution -- substituting major chords for minor chords. G is your overall tonal center, like every post has been telling you. Occasionally you modulate, like we have told you. After hearing it, it sounds more major, but again, if you really want to dig into it, map out just the bass and lead and see what you find there first. Then look at your inner harmony. You will have to ask yourself, "Am I subbing major for minor here or minor for major?" But hopefully seeing the relationships between your roots and lead lines will shed light on this. 

 

Pop Quiz: What are Bb and Eb chords called in G major? 

They're called substitutions. 

I even put a reference chart here

 

EDIT: ごめん。昨日ちょっとイライラしてた。

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13 hours ago, Moso said:

 

You're playing around with more than one key here and doing a lot of substitution -- substituting major chords for minor chords. G is your overall tonal center, like every post has been telling you. Occasionally you modulate, like we have told you. After hearing it, it sounds more major, but again, if you really want to dig into it, map out just the bass and lead and see what you find there first. Then look at your inner harmony. You will have to ask yourself, "Am I subbing major for minor here or minor for major?" But hopefully seeing the relationships between your roots and lead lines will shed light on this. 

 

Pop Quiz: What are Bb and Eb chords called in G major? 

They're called substitutions. 

I even put a reference chart here

 

EDIT: ごめん。昨日ちょっとイライラしてた。

Where are the modulations occurring and what type of modulation?   Diatonic Common Chord.
Altered Common Chord.
Enharmonic Modulation using Mm7 Chord.
Deceptive Cadence.
Enharmonic Modulation using °7 Chord. ect...

It seems the substitutions are borrowing from the G dorian mode mabey? theat could explaing the Bb but the Eb in the key of G major how is that working?  mabey a V/iiand a V/vi? I have no clues. I have two other songs you could anyalyze fo fun. One has a F#major in the key of C and the other might not have a key at all.

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6 minutes ago, Quintin penola said:

Where are the modulations occurring and what type of modulation?   Diatonic Common Chord.
Altered Common Chord.
Enharmonic Modulation using Mm7 Chord.
Deceptive Cadence.
Enharmonic Modulation using °7 Chord. ect...

It seems the substitutions are borrowing from the G dorian mode mabey? theat could explaing the Bb but the Eb in the key of G major how is that working?  mabey a V/iiand a V/vi? I have no clues. I have two other songs you could anyalyze fo fun. One has a F#major in the key of C and the other might not have a key at all.

1) Your song wasn't particularly fun or interesting to analyze. You asked for help. I tried to help you. Which brings me to... 

2) I don't actually think you want any help. 

 

I'm out. Good luck, kid. 

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4 hours ago, Moso said:

1) Your song wasn't particularly fun or interesting to analyze. You asked for help. I tried to help you. Which brings me to... 

2) I don't actually think you want any help. 

 

I'm out. Good luck, kid. 

you dont gotta be a rude about it peace.

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16 hours ago, Quintin penola said:

you dont gotta be a rude about it peace.

Your song itself was fine. I even thought it was kind of cool. The analysis of your song wasn't particularly interesting. (EDIT: This is not an insult. The world is full of good songs that aren't interesting to analyze. I came back into this thread specifically to try to help you understand I take no issue with your song.) And make no mistake -- you were rude (even if I give you the benefit of the doubt, it seems you're just not paying attention or something equally careless), which is why I've stopped bothering to even try to help you. We gave you a decent amount of information to work with, most of which you just ignored. And your posts were simply getting silly. 

 

If you truly want to analyze your song, then take all the information and direction that has been suggested to you, and actually try to do an analysis of your own. After you have that analysis in full, then come back if you want and others can help you take it section by section. 

 

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8 hours ago, Moso said:

1) Your song wasn't particularly fun or interesting to analyze. You asked for help. I tried to help you. Which brings me to... 

2) I don't actually think you want any help. 

 

I'm out. Good luck, kid. 

Thats a pretty rude comment to me. 

1. U also asked if you wanted to analyaze two otther songs beacuse you seem to be into thoery (for fun) which has nothing to do with this song. then you proceed to be make your little comment.

2. what you think is what you think but you cant read my mind, and no I dont want your help in the future

I'm out. Peace

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27 minutes ago, Quintin penola said:

1. U also asked if you wanted to analyaze two otther songs beacuse you seem to be into thoery (for fun) which has nothing to do with this song. then you proceed to be make your little comment.

2. what you think is what you think but you cant read my mind, and no I dont want your help in the future

I'm out. Peace

I didn't ask you for any other songs. You're on another planet, friend. Like I mentioned before, even if I give you the benefit of the doubt, you're at best not paying attention. 

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46 minutes ago, Moso said:

I didn't ask you for any other songs. You're on another planet, friend. Like I mentioned before, even if I give you the benefit of the doubt, you're at best not paying attention. 

I asked You if You wanted to anaylze 2 other song for fun, you no what I meant. 

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19 minutes ago, Quintin penola said:

I asked You if You wanted to anaylze 2 other song for fun, you no what I meant. 

No, not at all. Either your typing or your English or both are very bad. You quite literally and directly are contradicting yourself. I see also that I'm not the only other person having this issue with you. 

 

Anyway, like I said, good luck. I'm unfollowing, like I should have a while ago. I can't believe I stayed in this thread this long...

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1 hour ago, Moso said:

No, not at all. Either your typing or your English or both are very bad. You quite literally and directly are contradicting yourself. I see also that I'm not the only other person having this issue with you. 

 

Anyway, like I said, good luck. I'm unfollowing, like I should have a while ago. I can't believe I stayed in this thread this long...

shut up you no what i meant you smart ass

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All right, I'd say it's time to cool things down between you two. Let's give this a break.

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Can't listen (at work right now), but when someone brings up a 'what key is it in' question, my first reaction is "why are you asking?"   If you are going to score it, then you want to choose a key (or keys) that eliminate the need for tons of accidentals, just to make it easier.  But otherwise, why try to designate a key at all?  Maybe if you were having a guest instrumentalist do an improvised lead, you could say "G, sometimes Bb, sometimes C". :blink:

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On 1/1/2018 at 18:47, Moso said:

We gave you a decent amount of information to work with, most of which you just ignored. And your posts were simply getting silly. 

 

I, for one, found the information quite indecent and very confusing.

 

It is neither wise nor useful to presume that we all understand the same language in the same way.  Difficult to know where to start - especially in text among amateurs with different grasps of theoretical concepts - but it certainly requires greater one-cumulative-step-at-a-time clarity and a severe reduction of ambiguity.

 

My impression is that you have made a seriously decent fist of teaching yourself some theory - and of a type which evidently works happily for you - but, to pass that information along successfully to another we need to patiently comprehend where that person is actually at in order to help them reach where they wish to go.

 

Better efficacy can undoubtedly be achieved face-to-face.

 

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On 2018-01-04 at 04:26, Lazz said:

 

Better efficacy can undoubtedly be achieved face-to-face.

 

 

I'm sure both Moso and Quintin are wishing for exactly that! :D

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

/Sorry Lazz and the rest of you guys, I had to. ;)

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41 minutes ago, The S said:

I'm sure both Moso and Quintin are wishing for exactly that! :D

Heh, I'm getting a picture of me at a whiteboard full of scrawls, marker in hand, pulling my hair out. Meanwhile QP is smacking bubble gum and smiling. :P

Man, every time I think I've unfollowed this thread, I get another email notice. 

"Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!!"
 

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On 1/3/2018 at 19:26, Lazz said:

 

I, for one, found the information quite indecent and very confusing.

 

It is neither wise nor useful to presume that we all understand the same language in the same way.  Difficult to know where to start - especially in text among amateurs with different grasps of theoretical concepts - but it certainly requires greater one-cumulative-step-at-a-time clarity and a severe reduction of ambiguity.

 

My impression is that you have made a seriously decent fist of teaching yourself some theory - and of a type which evidently works happily for you - but, to pass that information along successfully to another we need to patiently comprehend where that person is actually at in order to help them reach where they wish to go.

 

Better efficacy can undoubtedly be achieved face-to-face.

 

I know a bit of theroy, But this song I wasnt using any theory, 

 

On 12/31/2017 at 13:45, Quintin penola said:

I worked my way backwards so I started the progession I play in the Chorus in the Key of G ( no lyrics), Then came the verse using the Gmajor chord going to Amajor so on(lyrics). From there went to the prechorus(lyrics) thingy which lead lead the the Chorus (lyrics).

 

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On 1/3/2018 at 10:21, Mike B said:

Can't listen (at work right now), but when someone brings up a 'what key is it in' question, my first reaction is "why are you asking?"   If you are going to score it, then you want to choose a key (or keys) that eliminate the need for tons of accidentals, just to make it easier.  But otherwise, why try to designate a key at all?  Maybe if you were having a guest instrumentalist do an improvised lead, you could say "G, sometimes Bb, sometimes C". :blink:

Doing some more research I've come to the conclusion I'm in the key of G minor or G aeolian mode. What throws everything off is the G major chord. How am I in the key of G minor if Im playng the i as a I? The only thing I could think of is an alteted chord. I guess you can say I'm borrowing from the the paralled key which is G major the I chord. I think they would call this a picardy third , but this is mostly used to end the peice in a minor key on the I in the parralle key. Dont know if I'm correct but it dose Justify all the chords I'm playing thoery wise. Scales you can use are G pentatonic Blues scale G Aeolian mode.

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Quote

But this song I wasnt using any theory

^_^ :rolleyes::blink::blush: Seriously? LOL

Are you sure you wouldn't like to rethink that statement?

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3 hours ago, tunesmithth said:

^_^ :rolleyes::blink::blush: Seriously? LOL

Are you sure you wouldn't like to rethink that statement?

Lol I wasnt, what make it interstion is I'm singing using the G blues scale, but also sing some G minor Diatonic notes in there. So the song is truley a blend.

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looks like the Aeolian mode works as a scale for improvision, but the harmonic fuction would still have problems. The I chord should be a i and the II would have to be a iidim. I treid to look at the A as a V/V in G Aeolian but it would break the rules because it dosent reslove on D  the V chord. it resolves on VII. Also my V chord should be a v, In harmonic minor the V is major, but that would make my VII a viidim. In the end this will always break rules.

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On 1/6/2018 at 13:16, Quintin penola said:

 So the song is truley a blend.

 

On 1/6/2018 at 14:56, Quintin penola said:

In the end this will always break rules.

 

 

Annnnd.... scene. 

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